Morality was killed bt Govt officers who right from Excise, Sales tax deppt , pollution deppt, electricity board, ration offices, ssi offices, municipal bodies, PWD's, forest deptt, minings etc.etc. etc. have sucked blood of India like a leech.
RE:RE:Govt. Officers responsible
by Abhinav Thakur on Feb 03, 2007 11:50 AM
Yes. We all know the problem, but not the solution. Be part of the solution and not the problem. Do you even vote? If not, you have no reason to whine.
RE:RE:RE:Govt. Officers responsible
by prasun premrajan on Feb 03, 2007 12:53 PM
I dont vote and will not vote coz i have no credible option to choose from..? so what does that mean??? The Morality of the country stink so much....there is no point in voting. there is no politician who really deserves my vote out there. Its like donating to some charitable organizaton s who then re directs the money to terrorists gropus.
RE:RE:RE:RE:Govt. Officers responsible
by on Feb 03, 2007 01:16 PM
Good. Just say "I am angry." and take a black flag and sit on stone for years. And things will ever change.
You should vote and select "lesser evil" of the two if you think both are bad.
Use your head, be smart, do something, but for god's sake don't come to this website and start whining and spread negative thoughts in society.
RE:Govt. Officers responsible
by Indra nil Sengupta on Feb 03, 2007 12:28 PM
It is very easy to generalise and pass on the blame to bureaucracy. I do not believe in such generalisations. All government employees can not be corrupt. There are some incorruptible persons everywhere, among the politicians among the government employees everyehere. Two things are to be blamed one is system another is attitude. Consumerism has spread like a virus. All are running after electronic items, house hold gadgets, a/c, freedge, cars, posh apartments, club membership, etc. A gap is created between the demand and supply. You can not increase the supply of money easily unless you resort to unfair means. A simple life style should be encouraged. Thuere should be compulsory teaching of moral sciences and values in all syllabus of study. There should be stringent measures of punishment for corrupt practices as well. However difficult it may sound this has to be done for us and future generation.
RE:RE:Govt. Officers responsible
by on Feb 03, 2007 01:13 PM
What makes you think that "consumerism" or "buying a freeze or car" is evil and kills morality in the person?
Do you think if you bought a charkha and started your simple living on it, it will make you moral?
Consumerism is not bad. Atleast government gets sales tax from people who don't even feel income tax. Atleast, part of their "hard-earned" black money goes into building highways and modernising airports.
RE:RE:RE:Govt. Officers responsible
by Indra Sengupta on Feb 04, 2007 11:06 PM
It is a question of feelings. Read between the lines. People cheating others or commiting suicide to avoid creditors, credit card loans have multiplied manyfold.
lets not discuss on pakistan. The gendral was right in lost morality in the present india. I whould have liked to ask the gendral on the special powers of the military and its abuse in manipur. We should as an indian feel ashamed of these kind of acts of the army. We in india are more concerned of srilankan tamils and the afganistanis. raather than our own people in assam, Manipur and nagaland. is it not. The values of humanity and ahimsa are long forgotten. Its just power and gundayisam and the urge to make money is gaining grounds in our present india. I whould like to here fron all of you on the issue of eradicating caste from our land. how about that!!!
RE:Morality and Ethics
by on Feb 03, 2007 11:48 AM
So what you did? whats your contribution apart from giving lecture on non-violence?
Indian armymen goto assam,mizoram to save lives of our countrymen from ULFA. Army has put their own lives in danger for them. And all you can do is sit here, open website and spit on whole of Indian Armymen for mistakes of a few. Thats all you can do ?
Do you even know difference between BSF and Indian Army?
In my opinion, BSF has done a good job in securing indian borders. Kudos to them!
RE:Morality and Ethics
by padmanabhan nair on Feb 03, 2007 01:11 PM
mistakes of a few??
on the name of fighting terrorism any one can do any atrosity to "N" number of people is it then lets not say that we are a peace loving nation
I am not taking any thing away from the BSF but there should be some accountability for those few people as you have mentioned. Because the true value of freedom and democracy is not only for those like you and me but also for every one in this contry.
I truely understand the difficulty in fighting these kind of a gurilla war and the difficulty in diffrenciating the innocent from the culprit, but still the acts are not justified.
As far as what I have done for nation building and ahimsa, I dont think I hav to explain any one.
morality is not an cast iron pillar that stays on and on without change.It evolves with the society to meet the new challenges of life.The nostalgia of past morality, is often a sign of oldage.
RE:morality
by samir sahu on Feb 03, 2007 11:52 AM
It is foolish to say that morality evolves. It is like the argument of the sophists whom Socrates debunked.Just because the General opposed Indian Army's involvement in SriLanka to save Tamils it is unfair to attack him Mr Tamilian. Grow up.
yes, it is a fact that morality has vanished from this country and at each and every step humanity is brutally killed or murdered but who is to be blamed for that? Are we and our ancesstors not equally responsible for this? And at least now can we sit behind and and think what solutions and remedoies can be framed and brought in our day to day practice and save our younger generations.
We have to now strive to regain that lost pride of the nation and need action in that direction.
RE:who is to blamed for this?
by on Feb 03, 2007 11:52 AM
It seems you have lost of pride. Please goto nearest police station and file a report to find it.
My pride for myself and for my country is intact. I don't need a certificate from you or anyone else for my pride. Thank you.
Its so ture that Morality and Ethics have been erased from our society to such an extent that in most of the cases people don't even realize or question it.
Although this is out of context example, it is very relevant to the topic of discussion: I was following the reality show BIG BOSS in India. Its basically a game with some rule like one contestant will be voted out every week. Sounds great right.. But what happens is that the public votes out Rakhi (some people like her and some don't.. but the majority disliked her and she got voted out). Then the Big Boss decides to bring her back. This they did after the majority of the public has spend all the money to vote her out. The result is that Big Boss made money and Rakhi is back totally against the people's verdict.. Shows that BIG BOSS has no Ethics.. Fine.. But what about the public who keeps voting (read paying money to BB) even after this incident happend as if nothing unEthical happend on the show?
You might say that this is a Rality show crap that I am talking about... For those people let me take a more realistic example: Our country's Home Minister Shivraj Patil was voted out in the LS polls in 2004. What happend was he was made a MP in Rajya sabha and brought into the cabinet and made the HOME MINISTER of the country against the public verdict just becasue the "BIG BOSS" whats him there. I fell insulted because even though I voted this guy out and the majority in my conctituancy did the same... He is back in the cabinet against the public verdict... How many did even notice this and feel looted in a democracy. If your answer is that you did feel insulted.. then my dear fellow citizen.. 'I am proud of you' and feel that there is some morality still left in the country.
There are millions of example like this in today's Indian society.
RE:Morality and Ethics
by on Feb 03, 2007 11:55 AM
Its better to have Shivraj patil who is educated atleast than some thug or murderer elected by us(based on our cast-votes).
RE:Morality and Ethics
by raj kumar on Feb 03, 2007 11:02 AM
I dont know about the reality show.However I would like to comment on the Shivraj Patil thing. If there is a provision in the constitution like the one that happened in the case of Mr.SP how can one call it a morallity issue. Mr.SP is a talented and a respected politician. Just because people voted him out does not make him a un suitable candidate for a cabinet position.People are not always right. There are so many factor that go into a person getting elected by people particularly caste factor.Some time even criminals and rowdy sheters get elected. To the Rajya Sabha a person is elected by the elected representatives. Arguablly they are more qualified that the common voter. It is perfectly right if the PM used RS route to accomadate a deserving person voted out by the people. THAT IS DEMOCRACY FOR YOU MY FRIED.
Pakistan should be removed from the world Map. Terrorism originated from tht. country. americans and indians should throw nuclear bombs like the americans did on Japan.
RE:RE:Remove Pakistan
by Naveed nawaz on Feb 03, 2007 11:24 AM
How naive are we?..We all have bad people in the lot..I think its the diabolical approach of the government that has to be questioned..Come out of India and Pakistan and meet them living abroad...They are like one social family...Hardly we can notice any difference..We are like frogs living in a well..Come out and try to share the differences... "Only the dead have seen the end of war..." ---Plato
RE:Remove Pakistan
by Anita a on Feb 03, 2007 02:12 AM
You speak like a terrorist yourself! It is the americans who aided Osama during cold war period to weaken Russia! And now they have turned against each other. And you talk as if americans are our greatest friends.
How on earth can you support the nuclear bombing of Japan? I would rather have people like you thrown out of earth!
At least read more and try to improve your knowledge. It will keep you from sounding like a moron in future..
RE:RE:Remove Pakistan
by IndiaCarerFromAbroad on Feb 03, 2007 05:41 AM
Hi, Japan understood its mistake & now both US, Japan are friends and India too. Nowbody will cheat India as big as China cheated during 1962. Osama doesn't deserve any pity for any reasons. Also, I don't want to give any other comment about the heading of this topic. We are a peace loving country and we are the patients sick of terrorism and the other side also understand that there is a limit for our patience. There are lot of diplomatic efforts going on between our countries and we understanding that from daily news from both of our leaders (India & Pakistan).
RE:RE:RE:Remove Pakistan
by IndiaCarerFromAbroad on Feb 03, 2007 06:11 AM
Hi, I forgot to mention one more point. Now we have better ties with China too. The bilateral trade is boosting. India also need to export some value added things too.
RE:RE:RE:Remove Pakistan
by Thambidurai Karthik on Feb 04, 2007 08:12 PM
What are you trying to justify Mr.Raj? US bombing Japan? British too have similar justification for every massacre in India. The hard fact is, there is no justification for violence, small scale or large scale.
Everyone uses the word morality differently, as it fits them. It is very subjective. For example all atrocities committed to Afgan people by Taliban were based on morality and their definition of morality. Even though you fight for a moral India, your morality has different definition than Taliban%u2019s. This is the main cause for all conflicts around the world. Every society (Every one) have their own definition for morality and the problem arises when one society (or individual) tries to impose their (his/her) definition on the other.
We are living in a democracy and everyone have their own freedom. You can not impose your ideologies on anyone. People have the tendency to fight back anything that is imposed on them and that is the lesson history has taught us.
Lets not justify violence in any form and Lets us start to accept people irrespective or their race, faith and color. Mistakes done by individuals, imposing their view on morals have deep implications to the human society and affects people badly.
RE:nonsense
by abhishek kul on Feb 03, 2007 12:28 AM
What ever he is saying is less crapier than wht u think u r saying. Stay in US and don't worry about India. I dont know why people like u even spend time reading articles...
Many many thnx. to Resp. Gen. Thapan & as also rediff for this article.
There's a word in our language "Vidya"... the literal meaning of this word is "knowledge", "Gyan", but when it was used for the very first time in the Rigveda...it was not to convey anything about knowledge or Gyan but its actually awareness...alertness...which leads a human to being intutive...
now there's another word "SHIKSHA", what does this word actually mean..Education?...no..certainly not..it is equvivalent to the phonetics in the English language...not enough space to elaborate on these things here..but if these things are pondered upon then all our problems of values & maorality can be addressed with...there r many many such things in our literature, culture..,, when the level of & as also the quality of education in our country will increase & improve someday & when people will once again realize the true colours of our culture by the way of understanding the forgotten meanings & the true sense it carries with it...all this problems of Morality wud be addressed with...this include the right understanding of "Satya" & "Non-violence" in place of the rubbish of Gandhi...when u understand the true meanings of the word "Vidya", "Shiksha" for eg.,there r many such things in our traditional religious scriptures...man becomes intuitive..& what follows is innocence..."Satya"..for god sake not the fake "Satya" of Gandhi but "Satya" i.e the by product of innocence..when a human naturally becomes lovable & non-violent...values & morality are comparatively very easy & natural things to come by in a human..if a child is educated by including such bits of literature that conveys all this things...a child will be natuarally moulded in such a way that values..morals can be dealt with but the prima facie necessity is that we desperately need to get rid of Gandhi....& pl. do it as fast as possible.
the above thoughts r only in bits & the whole thing needs to be understood by catching the right words & understanding more in few words.
any one reading this pl.don't reach to any conclusion by reading only one time...think on it..again think on it.
RE:morality
by on Feb 03, 2007 01:07 AM
Mr.Trivedi, Your passage is senseless..u have no idea wht u r writing. but ur ideas in general and in particularly about Gandhiji seems to be foolish....u need some Shiksha again.. if you had right SHIKSHA.. u will understand that there was no reference to Gandhiji in above interview of Gen. Thapan.
I have seen Indian guys and gals of your cheap category hailing Hitler here in Germany in front of Germans..
U seems to be from Uttar Pradesh origin..go and clean your home first..then blame Gandhiji.
Atleast for God's sake pls. refer Gandhiji as GANDHIJI.. he was much greater then u... Even foreigners take his name with respect. Indian student. Germany.
Thanks to Rediff for such an excellent interview. Hats off to Lt.Gen. M.L. Thapan. This should be an eye-opener for the new generation. At the time of the Bangladesh War when India swung into action I was sitting with a very senior official of the Ministry of Information & Broadcasting and I expressed the same question to him ie. whether it is an appropriate step. His reply was that the need of the hour is to weaken a hostile neighbour who is giving trouble at two fronts on the East and West. Later on we shall have to formulate a strategy to tackle the situation with the new neighbour. It was this aspect which we forgot once the objective was achieved. India became complacent and Pakistan tried its best to brew hatred in Bangladesh by the Muslim fundamentalists. At that time it was said that Bengali Muslims are first Bengalis then Muslims. This attitude was gradually changed by Muslim fundamentalists and now they are like any other Islamic country with little regard for the neighbour who helped them to be on their feet. The lack of foresight on the part of Indian leaders, the neglect of a newly emerging and weak neighbour and complacency were all responsible for the deterioration in relations with Bangladesh. Regarding moral values unless we pay attention to discipline in educational and professional institutions, introduce moral lessons, Yoga and meditation in a big way the country will not be able to come out of the Materialistic syndrome. Pradeep Saran.
Salutations to Lt. Gen. Thampan for speaking , and to Rediff for bringing to us "The Voice Of A Soldier". He is the product of a bygone era when everyday was a battle to live in our own country with dignity.When today's generation is busy revolting against the racial discrimination melted out to a beautiful, wealthy , celebrity by another country which makes the front page of our newspapers, it is only people like him who reads about the gang rape of a "low caste" villager woman whos brother fell in love with an "upper class" woman.When the batons and bullets of the enemy speed towards you ,it didn't matter to you if you were protected by an untouchable or a brahmin.I sometimes feel that this freedom that your Generation fought for and died for, which we take for granted, have made us blind to the values that made it all possible. Maybe one day when we stand the danger of losing this freedom, then we will gain our morality.Until then ,I pray to the Almighty to forgive us for paying our cricketers more than we pay the widow and children of a martyred armyman and for skipping through the footnoted newspaper article about the death of three more BSF Javans at some obsceure out post so that we can get to the sports section quicker and mourne the performance of our cricket team again. Thank You once again Sir.
