Re: azadi
by SHS on Oct 12, 2010 03:40 PM
Guns of the terrorist & Jhidis cannot divide and liberate any country. All the followers of the Osama can not win any war.
Re: azadi
by Bharatiar on Oct 12, 2010 03:51 PM
> Guns alone cannot suppress any people fighting for self-determination and liberation.
"self-determination and liberation" - big words that mean NOTHING in the context of Kashmiri insurgency.
Secession is illegal as per the Indian constitution. None of us have the right to secede. That is a good enough reason for India to act to end Kashmiri insurgency.
But EVEN setting that aside - India has a deep interest in stemming the tide of Islamist extremism that has already engulfed much of Pakistan/Afghanistan and is spilling over to India in Kashmir. It's threatening the well-being of India's own citizens, many of who are Muslims.
The likes of LeT believe in an ideology where life after death is more valuable than life here and now, on Earth. As per them, it's perfectly OK for the life here to be thoroughly hellish if they'll get to enjoy the pleasures of heaven later.
This perversion of Islam is simply not acceptable, not just to non-Muslims, but to an overwhelming majority of Muslims themselves. Pakistan has been unable to stem this evil - it is unofficially in a civil war ("motivated" by America, no doubt) trying to fight it. We cannot let Kashmir too fall a victim to Jehadism, not necessarily because we have a special love for Kashmiris, but simply because it has the potential to deeply harm India.
Re: Re: azadi
by trinity sareem on Oct 12, 2010 08:37 PM
i dont know who u r.so whats religion what do u believe in . so u think . there z no life after death.prove it 2 the world dat there is no life after death. so that every human being vl becomelike you. r u an hindu r an atheist. u cant prove a single word of glorious 2 be wrong. all muslims of the world challenge u mr. bharatiar. u r a fool. how many sins have u comitted in your life . what do you think dat no 1 in this universe vl hold you coller . haa. there is no escape. islam is spreading fast. it is the fastest growng religion in the world. stop it if u can. u r going to ban burka shame on u. so people like u allow their daughters half naked to the market. what a shame. do u believe in bharat mata . so this universe as per u was created by whom by no 1 isnt it. plz create an planet like earth . if u can. can u defeat death. stop it if u can. stop earthquakes. stop it if u can. the fist human was Adam may peace be upon him. u in great loss.
Re: Re: Re: azadi
by Bharatiar on Oct 13, 2010 01:48 AM
> stop earthquakes. stop it if u can.
Brother, religion is a cruel joke that history has played on us. There *may* be some good ideas in religions that are of "spiritual" value, I suppose. I'm afraid I find all of them quite nonsensical. Sorry.
It's a travesty that there is so much strife in this world in the name of pure nonsense. But this is what makes life fun as a human, no? :-)
Re: azadi
by JGN on Oct 12, 2010 03:28 PM
The biggest b1under committed by India was helping the Kashmiris in 1947. MaharajaHariSingh wanted his small territory to be an independent country but he could not save his rear end from heavily armed PakS0ldiers masquarading as triba1s. He signed the deed of accession only when they reached just 50 kms short of Srinagar. Had the IndianArmedForces not intervened at that time, there would not have been any Kashmir for these guys to fight for. The KashmiriMuz1ims would have been crushed under the b00ts by the PunjabiAndSindhiMuz1ims like what they had done to the people of EastPakistan in 1971.
Re: Re: azadi
by Balan Iyer on Oct 12, 2010 03:59 PM
Our Govt took 5 days to decide whether to help Kashmir or not.On the sixth day the Govt asked the Maharaja to sign the instrument of accession and sent the Indian Army to Kashmir.This is as per the artcle in Times of India some years back written before his death by LtGen Thorat who was in charge of Indian Army Operations in Kashmir.
Re: Re: azadi
by Balan Iyer on Oct 12, 2010 04:04 PM
You are right.If the Refe rendum was conducted in Kashmir in 1947,then all the Kashmiris would have willingly come under the Indian Fold.But unfortuna tely,the entire Kashmir Issue was goofed up right from the start.
Dear All, I talked to many folks about it.. Our KP Doctors work in true spirit of Medical Ethics. There are many instance when doctors and even GUrus have healed the wounds of enemy soldiers , given them food and water. That is Human aspect of medical Services. Lets be practical about it.
What is more worrying is the way , our enemy uses our humantarian efforts to take political mileage of it . it is true fascist and hitlers theory to establish credence to their theory by showing victory beyond enemy lines. We must project it as our Human Effort to cure even our Enemies but at the same time showcase how much pervert our Enemy is that he misuses our Human endeavour in name of Poilitics.
Re: Re: HUman Endeavour misquoted and misused by GEELANI
by Brijesh Tamber on Oct 12, 2010 03:22 PM
If Kashmiris seek self determination through the barrell of a gun what do you expect??flowers in return.
Re: Re: HUman Endeavour misquoted and misused by GEELANI
by JGN on Oct 12, 2010 03:23 PM
The Chinese had rolled their MBTs (MainBattleTanks) into Tiannaman Square. Roll our MBTs into Srinagar and see the fun. Not a single j1hadi will be in sight. The can b1ackmail only soft states like India.
Re: Re: HUman Endeavour misquoted and misused by GEELANI
by Argumentative Indian on Oct 12, 2010 03:23 PM
Joining Pakistan is not Azadi for Kashmir. It is merely the agenda of ISI and its supporters, like yourself, under the assumed name of again, a member of the tribe you so pretend to dislike.
Re: Re: Re: Re: HUman Endeavour misquoted and misused by GEELANI
by SHS on Oct 12, 2010 03:46 PM
Brahmins never rule the Kashmir. All u r forcefully converted to !z!am by invaders.
Re: Re: Re: Re: HUman Endeavour misquoted and misused by GEELANI
by Iadmire on Oct 12, 2010 04:00 PM
If at all there is a question of freedom, then that question should be raised by indians whose land had been occupied by pakistan and kashmir muslims... and not the other way around... This is why the mughal emperor invasion and their atrocities should be taught in schools.. However, the so called congress will never allow this as that will enlighten our people and they loose their votes.. Power mongering chooths..
Re: Re: Re: Re: HUman Endeavour misquoted and misused by GEELANI
by JGN on Oct 12, 2010 03:36 PM
golmalkar, are you talking about the nasty dynasty of a KashmiriBrahmin??
Re: Re: Re: Re: HUman Endeavour misquoted and misused by GEELANI
by SHS on Oct 12, 2010 03:44 PM
Guns of the terrorist & Jhidis cannot divide and liberate any country. All the followers of the Osama can not win any war.
Re: Re: Re: Re: HUman Endeavour misquoted and misused by GEELANI
by Argumentative Indian on Oct 12, 2010 03:50 PM
Wrong on all counts.
Kashmiri's did not accept the brand of Islam, you propose & its unnecessary baggage, citizenship of Pakistan, but rather soundly rejected it by turning out in a 66% majority to vote and participate in a democratic process that had Islamist fanatics crapping their pants.
The Delhi throne was not usurped by anyone, the last vestiges of the Mughals, was decimated by the Maratha Empire. The Marathas were the last rulers of India, before the British traders arrived into power.
Pakistan is now only comparable to Somalia in every respect. Pakistanis need the world's sympathy and a new set of politicians.
It's that simple - he's an Islamist ideologue who wants to replay a mini-partition of India in Kashmir. From his views its clear that he wants to import Pakistaniyat into Kashmir.
Perhaps he is not aware of the outright ugliness of Taliban-style Islamofasicsm. Perhaps he is not aware that an increasing number of Pakistanis themselves are tired of the Islamist strife within their country, and that Pakistan has become synonymous with international terrorism. Or worse still, he is OK with all of it.
If the story of Pakistan teaches us anything, it's that it's never a good idea to hand over politics to the overly pious. They place God above humans, and claim the right to speak for him. You can't argue with the Almighty and His men - you only can bow down and obey.
I am sure that there are much better leaders amongst Kashmiris who can voice dissent against India.
Re: Re: Geelani is an Islamist.
by Argumentative Indian on Oct 12, 2010 03:28 PM
Your love and patriotism, though misplaced, for your own country, Pakistan, is touching. However, they cannot substitute for logic. India is not impoverished, rather it is a fearsomely well off country. The repeated bleatings of the world's largest number of poor etc., hide that we also have among the largest number of billionaires in the world, the largest population of middle class people in the world etc. etc. China is surviving on the efficiency of its government, it has barely a handful of companies worth their salt, India is thriving, despite its government.
Every Indian, at the root, is smart & ready for a global economy. You have obviously not set foot outside Pakistan, but one short visit to India & China, will tell you the difference between the people, the software.
Re: Re: Geelani is an Islamist.
by Argumentative Indian on Oct 12, 2010 03:30 PM
Your love and patriotism, though misplaced, for your own country, Pakistan, is touching. However, they cannot substitute for logic. India is not impoverished, rather it is a fearsomely well off country. The repeated bleatings of the world's largest number of poor etc., hide that we also have among the largest number of billionaires in the world, the largest population of middle class people in the world etc. etc. China is surviving on the efficiency of its government, it has barely a handful of companies worth their salt, India is thriving, despite its government.
Every Indian, at the root, is smart & ready for a global economy. You have obviously not set foot outside Pakistan, but one short visit to India & China, will tell you the difference between the people, the software.
Mullas are Arabs. They are able to control the entire south asia. Ordinary Paki was secular. But they were controlled by Arab Mullas who came to this country long before.
GILANI is another Arab Mulla who believes in ARAB IDEOLOGY
I hope there may be successors, legal heirs of Maharaja Hari Singh, of Kashmir? All the Kashmiri pandits along with the successors,legal heirs,kins of Maharaja should come together and claim their mother land Kashmir and kill all the infilterated separatist and also few kashmiri mujji (as exist in all states) who in conspiracy and collusion with the infilterated separatist drived the pandits out by claiming kashmirMeRehnaHongaThoAllah-o-akbarKehnaHonga",
As an example, some of the most disastrous leaders, led a personally disciplined life:
1) Adolf Hitler, was a teetotaller & highly disciplined person rising early each day. Enough to put most people off discipline for life!
2) Back home, Jyoti Basu, has always led a middle class life, his annual London Holiday, notwithstanding, however, I cannot off hand think of a more disastrous leader for West Bengal's prosperity, education & industrialization than Jyoti Babu!
A personally most cosmopolitan & secular person, gave birth to the world's worst communalist joke.
M. A. Jinnah was a westernized, pork loving person. We all know the sad joke that he gave birth to. In all fairness, he had envisioned a secular and modern islamic state, the communalistic joke that Pakistan has become today is due to that Delhi University Topper, the Late (& Brain Dead decades before his body perished) Zia Ul Haq.
Finally, one of the world's greatest leaders of all time, Winston Churchill, failed every exam he took, till his late twenties (I think), as a Prime Minister, rarely got up from bed before noon, smoked Cigars & drank copious quantities of whiskey daily.
So in sum, a political leader's personal life has no bearing, the Geelani is a curse for India, I don't care whether he's a saint or a philanderer in his spare time, thats his choice.
Re: Political leader's personal beliefs are IRRELEVANT
by Great Indian on Oct 12, 2010 02:40 PM
I FULLY support the bottmline you mentioned - "We don't care about personal lives of politicians - it is their political idealogies is what matter to us"
As per that - Geelani was / is / has been a curse to the nation.
Trying to rationalise his terrorist otbursts with the failure of Center's (perceived) non- accommodative nature is plain misleading..! If that is accepted - even Bin Laden's autrocities can be rationalised..!!
As an example, some of the most disastrous leaders, led a personally disciplined life:
1) Adolf Hitler, was a teetotaller & highly disciplined person rising early each day. Enough to put most people off discipline for life!
2) Back home, Jyoti Basu, has always led a middle class life, his annual London Holiday, notwithstanding, however, I cannot off hand think of a more disastrous leader for West Bengal's prosperity, education & industrialization than Jyoti Babu!
A personally most cosmopolitan & secular person, gave birth to the world's worst communalist joke.
M. A. Jinnah was a westernized, pork loving person. We all know the sad joke that he gave birth to. In all fairness, he had envisioned a secular and modern islamic state, the communalistic joke that Pakistan has become today is due to that Delhi University Topper, the Late (& Brain Dead decades before his body perished) Zia Ul Haq.
Finally, one of the world's greatest leaders of all time, Winston Churchill, failed every exam he took, till his late twenties (I think), as a Prime Minister, rarely got up from bed before noon, smoked Cigars & drank copious quantities of whiskey daily.
So in sum, a political leader's personal life has no bearing, the Geelani is a curse for India, I don't care whether he's a saint or a philanderer in his spare time, thats his choice.
As an example, some of the most disastrous leaders, led a personally disciplined life:
1) Adolf Hitler, was a teetotaller & highly disciplined person rising early each day. Enough to put most people off discipline for life!
2) Back home, Jyoti Basu, has always led a middle class life, his annual London Holiday, notwithstanding, however, I cannot off hand think of a more disastrous leader for West Bengal's prosperity, education & industrialization than Jyoti Babu!
A personally most cosmopolitan & secular person, gave birth to the world's worst communalist joke.
M. A. Jinnah was a westernized, pork loving person. We all know the sad joke that he gave birth to. In all fairness, he had envisioned a secular and modern islamic state, the communalistic joke that Pakistan has become today is due to that Delhi University Topper, the Late (& Brain Dead decades before his body perished) Zia Ul Haq.
Finally, one of the world's greatest leaders of all time, Winston Churchill, failed every exam he took, till his late twenties (I think), as a Prime Minister, rarely got up from bed before noon, smoked Cigars & drank copious quantities of whiskey daily.
So in sum, a political leader's personal life has no bearing, the Geelani is a curse for India, I don't care whether he's a saint or a philanderer in his spare time, thats his choice.
Re: Political Leader's Personal Lives & Beliefs are
by Vishnu Sharma on Oct 12, 2010 08:30 PM
Actually Hitler was not that highly disciplined as you would like to believe.
Yes, He was a teetotaller and a vegetarian who occasionally had fish (trout) and caviar.
But he rose very late in the morning because would ramble on with his inner circle till well past midnight (2:00 AM)
Also he had a mistress, a fact which he hid from the German people.
