I see a whole group of people in denial. I don't know what is wrong in portraying the wrong things that happened (happening even now) in the country so that every one becomes aware of the problem. Now, tell me before this how many of you were aware that these things ever happened in India ?
You people are like those white supremacists who deny holocaust and criticize those who make movies on them.
In every country,religion(non-religion) and culture shit happens! In some cultures and countries people realize and cry only when it hits the fan! In this digital world, as more and more people get educated, movies like these keep coming and hypocrites in every contry, religion and culture will keep complaining. Welcome to the brave new liberal world. Movies like these should keep coming (they should be subsidized) until every educated person gives up on their religion and starts thinking outside the box.
As far as Deepa is concerned, kudos to her for making a brave movie. But, this is what, her third movie on Indian & Hinduism issues ? That's one too many movies for Indo part of an Indo-canadian. That's enough picking on Hinduism. Now, it is time for her to make a movie about North American paedophiles and po(o)pe or evangelist nazis. May be she is quiet because too many american liberals are making movies on them.
RE:Water has dried out. We need flood now!
by Noel D on Feb 27, 2007 01:59 PM
And good luck to any one who tries to make a movie on Islam. If that person likes to live longer, he needs to save enough money so that his body can be saved in cryogens and hope to come alieve 100 years later when scientists find a way to bring people to life.
RE:Water has dried out. We need flood now!
by anand bhargava on Feb 28, 2007 08:22 AM
Looks like you are you in denial- that we expect more sincerity when you are scavenging on a culture..try to go thru the following post
RE:RE:Water has dried out. We need flood now!
by Noel D'Souza on Feb 28, 2007 11:25 AM
I guess there is no way to make people like you understand. Just googled about the population demography in India. It says it is only 16% upper caste. Out of the 84% may be 20% is minority. The rest of the population is the one our ancestors picked on to do the dirty jobs until 1947 all over the country and until few seconds ago in many parts of the country.
You can consider my opinions as scavenging on a culture or whatever you like, but until I hear or read '10,000 dalits were whole heartedly converted to brahminism' or '10,000 brahmin-dalit couples were married today', Hindusism is as hypocrite and as cruel as Christianity and Islam. But what are the odds of that happening? It is like expecting camel to walk thru the eye of the needle.
Just like yor narrow views dont change, my narow views won't change. At least, I know what it takes for me to change my narrow views. You still dont have a clue!
Your thought process is so narrow that you only noticed me scavenging on hindu culture , but not on christianity and Islam.
But it is nice to have conservatives all over the world. If they didnt exist, what would journalists, movie makers or comedians do for a living because there will not be any one to pick on.
RE:RE:RE:Water has dried out. We need flood now!
by Jatin Patel on Mar 06, 2007 02:12 AM
One, this topic is going from the movie to religion. So I'll initially talk about the movie and Deepa. I think the movie was brilliant and the people need to acknowledge that such things did happen. Although, as far as I know, in my area of Gujarat, child marriage was not too prevalent in the 30s. But still, its nice to have a movie with a decent message. And with Deepa bashing Indians too much, I completely disagree. She's made Fire, Earth, and Water, which may be considered controversial. But the fact that Fire dealt with lesbians, doesn't mean it bashes Indians. And Earth bashed Indians as much as any other desi movie does.
As far as Hinduism or any other religion being bad goes, I totally disagree. I mean, I agree that the way in which people use their religion is bad, but I don't think the religion itself is bad. The problem is with interpretation. People interpret religion for their own benefit and then we get problems with castes and so on. But I wouldn't say that it was the religion itself that is wrong. I mean, with Hinduism, castes were originally just a sign of a role in society, not a ranking. It was the people that made it what we know it to be.
I saw Water, Das Leben der Anderen, Zwartboek, Volver and El Laberinto del fauno. Zwartboek and Volver were NOT nominated for oscars even though they were in the short-list of 10. I found both these movies to be a lot better than Water. I think it is the rationale of the academy that any movie that shows the emerging powers India and China in bad light (read "backward" or "third world") is to be honored. Zwartboek is a beautiful movie. It deserved a place among the nominees. Volver was as good as Zwartboek but a lot better than Water.
For God's sake this was a canadian entry why did they dress like one except for the gorgeous Ms.Ray . One things we indians have to learn is having a disciplained dress code when every one wears a dress-do the same the men ware suits or tuxedos do the same since the movie is a canadin entry dress like one not in your ethnic costume this is what we indians fail to understand and if you try and say something they bring culture and tradition in between
RE:water was a CANADIAN entry !!!!!!!!!!!
by dfm on Feb 27, 2007 06:39 AM
For God's sake this was a canadian entry why DIDN'T they dress like one except for the gorgeous Ms.Ray . One things we indians have to learn is having a disciplained dress code when every one wears a dress-do the same the men wear suits or tuxedos do the same since the movie is a canadian entry dress like one not in your ethnic costume this is what we indians fail to understand and if you try and say something they bring culture and tradition in between
RE:RE:water was a CANADIAN entry !!!!!!!!!!!
by Governor General on Feb 27, 2007 11:30 AM
Are you sure you don't live in a country that lies next to the western border of India?
RE:RE:water was a CANADIAN entry !!!!!!!!!!!
by kinshuk maitra on Feb 27, 2007 08:43 AM
.. and we Indians also need to learn is how to write, spell, punctuate.
I have not watched Water, but I just saw some pictures of Lisa Ray...She has an excellent bust...And You gotta like that, whether you are Indian, American or from the Galapagos Islands....
Its a very well known fact that a junk movie like water will not get oscar and does not deserve to get the nomination also..And why the indians need to worry abt this movie when the movie got an entry from canada..And it shows all the nonsense from deepa mehta who imagined something abt hinduism and put it in her movie...She should be ashamed of being a Hindu who is defaming and giving a bad projection about the Sacred Hindu religion...
The movie did not even come in as an Indian entry in the oscars. It was a canadian movie entry. Why are we Indians even bothering about this lady so much and talking things like racism. Comeon guys get over it, it was a canadian movie entry and we should move on. The film was shot in srilanka and not India.
2 movies in recent times were an icing on the cake, Lagaan and Swades. They both showed the problems faced in India and esp rural India - castism, lack of education etc etc. But more importantly they showed the true human spirit which creates positive even in that environment, which is similar amongst all races despite the fact we learn from different textbooks. Mira's movies are usually good, but they have little value. Its easy to ask how many of you remember Bhuvan and Kachra and the postmaster of Swades or the villager who wants to have a restaurant. The only charachter I remember of Mira's movies is Dubey.
Wow, reading the comments by the "true Indians" and "FOB's" has really opened my eyes to the way NRI's are thought of.
1. Deepa Mehta is allowed to make any movie she wants about any message she wants to portray. It was an excellent movie, in my opinion, depicting one aspect of India's history. You can't just FORGET that it happened....
Probably you guys feel that Sati was a practice that was just myth. Anything that was "negative" should be censored, right? PLEASE, how lame.
Lets be real here, the types of movies you guys probably would want up there is hmmm....lemme think of the really "GREAT" movies Indian cinema has regurgitated....Anything w/Shah Rukh Khan?? (mind you, i watch his movies, but none of them really have any true message other than-"hi, i'm a 21 year old boy who graduated from college and i love you so lets get married")
2. "Most indian americans don't consider themselves indians"....and your fresh off the boat, eh? This is probably why you are called a FOB, lets be honest here. That is the most prejudiced remark I have ever encountered. Indian American's can claim two heritages....i was born and raised in America, so should i just ultimately deny the nation that offered my parents opportunity because I am Indian? And because I call myself American, does that make me an ABCD? Oh god, puke. Whoever thought of that term was probably drunk and pissed at some girl that left him. And because I'm American, does that mean that i should completely deny my parents and my forefathers history as well?
WE know where we come from. If you don't like it in America, then why did you come? Because you wanted to make money, right? Whatever.
FINAL THOUGHT: Deepa Mehta has an indian background, just because she doesn't live there doesn't mean she isn't Indian. Yes the movie was a Canadian entry, but thats because India has problems with movies that show something negative about the country. Too much sensoring going on.
Instead of complaining about Deepa Mehta, maybe you should b**** about the directors that recycle C movies over 700 times.
RE:Blatantly Ignorant
by Amit Jain on Feb 27, 2007 09:35 AM
Okay, first of all, I am sure you did not learn in Indian schools because of spellings such as "sensorship". Second, even in america, there is CENSORSHIP, so please do not tell us Indians how to run our country. And finally, my problem is over all with hindu bashing that goes on by new-liberals. If India indeed had CENSORSHIP like you talk about, M F Hussain will not be painting Sarswati in nude. Deepa was heckled and ran away fearing public opinion and persecution and not because Indian govt. or the censor board denied her right to make that movie. You will be surprised to know that India also has a vibrant democracy and as diverse set of people as the US if not more. Indians in the US (weather born there or not) have the habbit of being critical of everything back home and like Deepa Mehta, you seem to be such an example. I have lived in the US for more than 15 years before returning back to India and I can tell you that women in america at 60 years of age also are worried about who is going to pick me up for a date on Friday nights. I agree that there are certain good family values left in there too but to a few people and otherwise the whole place is a giant melrose place. People living in glass houses should not throw stones at others.
RE:RE:Blatantly Ignorant
by Manoj J on Feb 27, 2007 10:12 PM
some good points..some not so good.. new liberals -> neo liberals ( better usage )
MFH can draw Parvati and other Hindu godesses but not a picture of Mohd. He will be killed or his pictures will be banned. So much for censorship.
Indians in the US critical of home - criticism is good if the intentions are right. We should not be like that ostrich hiding his head in the sand when sandstorm happens...
60 year old women feeling lively -- how is that bad ?
I personally that 'Water' is a great movie and we should not run from out past.
RE:Blatantly Ignorant
by Savio J on Feb 27, 2007 05:27 AM
With all due respect, "Water" was not subtle. If you compare it to over-the-top Hindi flicks then it may be but it lacks the calibre of being "Oscar worthy".
Now that may be debatable, on what is "Oscar worthy" and no one but the academy displays more hypocricy in that area. But if the Oscars were to represent the highest honor bestowed on a filmmaker for his craft then "Water" should not be bought in as a Canadian or Indian entrant into this competition. Why? Because it is a mediocore film and cannot hold ground when placed against some other more elegant films from other parts of the globe. Some of our own regional films are perhaps more suited to enter the Oscars but thanks to the Bollywood clout, it is usally a Hindi film that gets selected!!
I am not opposed to Deepa Mehta or her roots or where she chooses to live. I am also not opposed to her making movies on subjects that show the darker side of our society - and she uses this beautifully to market it amongst wester audiences and earn a reputation as martyr filmmaker. She too, like the rest of us FOB's, is perhaps trying to do something worthwhile alongside raking in as much moolah as she possible can :) But what I can't stand is this lowering of the bar in movie making excellence... to promote movies like this as high art is just a load of bulls***!!!
RE:RE:Blatantly Ignorant
by isha kaur on Feb 27, 2007 08:36 PM
Haha, this is hilarious, not your response Savio, but the others. I have been completely maligned for being to "americanized", "not indian enough" and misspelling ONE word. I love it!
1. I never said that Water was oscar worthy, I never said it should win. Pan's Labryinth FULLY deserved the win, i just said it was much better than the dribble that India has produced.
I said that Water was a different movie, with a good theme, she knows HOW to be a filmmaker.
2. I fully support anyone on coming to the USA to make a living and provide a better lives for their families.....
BUT i detest when people come here and B**** about how much they hate the US. People come to the US thinking the streets are PAVED in gold but hello, they aren't!! Wake up, you gotta work for a living.
3. We are not arrogant, we just see how hard our parents have to work to make a living here in America and see the family in India living off of it and not having jobs themselves.
4. I could CARE less if someone were to call me an ABCD, its a assinine remark borne of someone's ignorance.
I've witnessed MORE hostility from INDIANS than I have from Indian Americans. You dont think there are unmarried women in India meeting men over the age of 25? I mean SERIOUSLY? I know its a nation of a billion, so the possibility that there might be ONE is definitely high.
AND Finally, to the people who say I shouldn't claim my Indian heritage because I dont know anything about India....y'all are hypocrites.
While you guys are typing on your...hmm...lets see, Dells? HPs? Compaqs? in your Jordache? Guess? Levi? jeans and your Guess? Armani? tshirts and eating your McDonald's? Pizza Hut? food.....you're going to lecture ME on being confused? HA! Please! India has been more westernized in the last 20 years than any nation I have visited.
Don't lecture me on my hypocrisy. At least I know I'm multicultural. You guys refuse to admit it.
RE:Blatantly Ignorant
by jaya vikram on Feb 27, 2007 05:42 AM
The movie anyway didn%u2019t deserve the Oscar and was not up to the mark. And the way Indians think ab NRIs that way is coz they forget their roots - so cant blame Indians on that! Movies that portray past or present should be encouraged, but mixing up things with a movie and ur aggression for have been called ABCD shows u are even below the average category! Well no offense meant! But first thing anyone should have is Politeness and thatz wat many of these guys who "pretend to be non-Indian origin" lack! well India teaches u that! comin to america or not is nothin u wanna comment on! if u are an ABCD, others come to America with their skill... so try to respect that! dont wanna go beyond that coz i believe silence is the mark of a wise man! t care buddy! in a short sentence, that movie lost cz it didnt deserve it.
RE:Blatantly Ignorant
by Manoj J on Feb 27, 2007 07:57 AM
Now this post shows some class. While watching the oscars , i was thinking what the academy will think of a nation that thinks Shah Rukh is a great actor. I am glad that his movies or for that matter any bollywood movie was not nominated.
We produce 1000 movies a year.. and none of subtance.
RE:RE:Blatantly Ignorant
by Vikram on Feb 27, 2007 06:32 AM
To whoever wrote the original post,
You think you can claim two heritages, huh. That's why you are called ABCD...can't even make up your mind as to your singular heritage! By the way, when you comment on Sati or anything that is Indian how much study have you really done on that subject. If you really want to claim your Indian heritage make some effort to understand it first, learn its languages, learn what it stand for, learn what its morals are, learn what it means to be an Indian. If you can't really do any of these things then don't claim any Indian heritage. India can very well do without the likes of you. India and Indians are not asking you to identify yourself as Indian so be happy with your country...if that country is willing to accept you that is. I could enlighten you on the term your gora country folks use to refer to your likes but then you would already have heard it and would have actually felt that being called ABCD is not the most demeaning after all! So fella if you can't make any effort to understand India then just shut up when it comes to matters concerning India. And please save us from your freedom of expression speech.
