May be China is right or may be wrong but we should not call it names. Someone has achieved something that they set out to do and that counts! I would rather see India having a train that keeps any commitment - even at 45KMPH!
I am writing this message from Shanghai China. I just travelled in the CRH "G" series train today morning, from Suzhou to Shanghai.
With lot of sadness let me tell you, the article published here is suggestive of a negative interest. We are having trains that travel at less than 150 kmph only. If we get a 350kmph train, we will and WE DEFINITELY WILL have passengers to travel in it. NO QUESTION of an economic unviability.
Now coming to China scenario. There are "G" series CRH trains, as well as "D" series CRH trains in China. The G series are the new ones, which fly at 350kmph. They charge about 60% higher amount against the old "D" series trains. But the old trains were also traveling at 220-230kmph. Given this fact, if you want to travel 100 or 100kms, should we spend 60% extra is a question. There, the question becomes genuine. But for long distances, the Chinese people prefer the fast trains. The economic viability is not an issue at all...
We Indians shouldnt be debating on this. Because we dont have the 350kmph, we dont have 230kmph either.
The Chinese started building these trains only 6-7 yrs back only. They imported the trains first, from Germany. Later they started importing the technology, but local manufacturing. They did the learning thru that. Now they are building the trains with their own technology. Smart !! .. Arent they? ...
Re: @ 35kmph, from Shanghai China
by Vikram shah on Jul 05, 2010 08:32 PM
madam may be you r too moneyed not to consider the cost... no public can be spent for fancy the retuerns/benifits for short term/long term must be considered. madam please just do not get mesmerised by what is shown to you... the chinese buble is bursting !!!!!
Re: Re: @ 35kmph, from Shanghai China
by anthony gonsalves on Jul 05, 2010 10:14 PM
looser vikram learn to apprecite if not u will rot in the slum mentality........sorry for my language but we Indians are way behind the developed world
Considering the population of China, even if 10% of the population wants to try to travel once for a pleasure and experience, they will recover the cost; with the arrival of more and more tourists, such trains will be used for tourist purposes, who may wish to cover more places faster. Hence, this project will definitely succeed. We, Indians, write negatively about China out of jealouse; instead of negative thinking, we should move positively in copying such projects and analyse how we can introduce such trains in India and improve our technology in our country. We talk, write and preach more than acting to improve the standards. Though in India we are improving standards slowly, we should do it at the Bullet Train speed.
Yesterday i got oppurtunity to travel by this Train,Max speed i checked was 330 Km/Hr , its nicely built and very comfortable but ticket price is almost as double as next fastest train whose max speed is 200 Km/Hr..It just took me 10 Mins less then second fastest train. Ticket cost for this train is 68 yuan(Wuxi to Shanghai) and for 2nd fastest train its 39 Yuan. Its worth to try its once but not anymore.
Re: I travelled by this Train yesterday
by Amit on Jul 04, 2010 06:24 AM
Most sensible balanced review. This is the point I was making....unless it is cost effective it is not worth it.
Maybe longer distances of above 1000 KM would make it worth the saving in time...not worth for less than 500 km.
Re: I travelled by this Train yesterday
by XianYe on Jul 04, 2010 02:49 PM
The 200-kph D series trains that run between Shanghai and Nanjing on the old tracks will be phased out in steps in 1-2 years. For example, the 6 or 7 pairs of D trains connecting Beijing and Shanghai will cease to operate when the Bejing-Shanghai HSR opens next year. All the other long-distance D trains are subject to the same fate. The capacity thus created will be used for freight trains.
Re: I travelled by this Train yesterday
by P R on Jul 04, 2010 08:34 AM
Of course cost will probably be adjusted based on public response. But to call them white elephants is a little over the top.
India is jealous of China's acheivement ,just as Pakis are jealous of india. Rather than trying to find there fault we should try and improve ourselves first. Indian trains are pathetic ,thanks to our people.
I think India should link all the metro cities with this kind of trains. using private companies. just like the 3 g auctions, all international companies should be allowed to enter the markety.
Guys it is just not bullet trains, china has set a great leap forward that the trains would not stop in any station. But a coach is standing on the roof of every station and the pax get in. When the train zooms in it picksup the top wagon from front and the ceiling opens for pax to get into the train. similarly an empty coach is always mounted at the end of the train. pax alighting will get into the coach and be ready. when the train enters in drops this coach on roof hanger and pick up the coach in front with pax in. This is an amazing technology that you have to see it to believe it. Soon china will introduce this to this world. and not copied from anywhere. We indians always in doomsday seeing others with jealously. Just learn to appreciate the achievements of human wherever it happens. Chinese are truly great workers as they have far better stamina than indians and can work more hours per day than average indian.
Re: New Tech
by Partha Sarathy on Jul 03, 2010 05:11 PM
This is not a new technology, the erstwhilte soviet union has this more than thirty years back, the soviet non stop trains also used to generate electricity in the stations where each reached. Also these trains are built not by Chinese, but by contracted German and other european companies. The good thing is Chinese are investing all the dollar reserves they are having in improving their infrastructure, while our dumb government is busy doing its usual politics.
Re: Re: New Tech
by jackson on Jul 03, 2010 06:10 PM
It may be true that german and european companies are supplying / building it. but the same thing goes with all aircraft and other rail industries. Boeing procures parts from more than 400 companies from Europe to Japan to build a plane. Any new technology in the world are always have the hands of the world. It matters who does it for whom. And China does it for their people. So it is great. Anything that india is going to build will certainly have foreign technology/expertise. What about our metros, nuclear plants, air force, navy, Telecom... all items supplied by foreigners.
Re: COPY Technology
by jackson on Jul 03, 2010 02:41 PM
There is nothing wrong about that. Copying exactly also needs skill. IF given a photocopy of that do you think it will happen in india tomorrow. It is about sharing the knowledge and using it for development. Nothing in india is its own except the population, pollution and corruption. Chinese are inventors of many since age old civilizations. Many human practices, martial arts, medicines, architecture methods etc are all original inventions of china that was looted by mongols and taken to korea & japan in olden days. read history. Indians lacks civic sense, discpline, public behaviour and dress code.
The present reality is that the best aerospace technology developed for concord flight could not be sustained due to the high operation cost involved. Hence few of the concord planes are the museum piece at europe. Simillar may be the fate of the high speed trains operating thru the magnet system which involves very high initial capital. the article indicates that the project is being done a whooping cost of 293 BILLION US$. then the operation cost is invovled. Hence there is definitely a question mark on the sustinence of the train-operations. I even sometimes wonder about the billion dollar projects involvingabout the space involing travel to mars, research involving nutrinos from the sun and so on. How much of such projects realy help even 5-10% of the world population. Instead of spending on such projects, the same funds can be diverted on the world basic sustaining forest and agricultural necessities. Such efforts may give employment as well as food-self reliance. We all do certain acts at times which involes catching the moon rather than few grains at our hand. When will the world wake up from such MAYA i.e illusion?
Re: high speed train
by jackson on Jul 03, 2010 02:36 PM
your stomach is boiling of china's achievements. typical indian. building train also need people to be employed, technology used, people and cargo transported, etc. And it is China not india. China never said that they divert money meant for forest to build trains. China also producing surplus agricultural products exporting all over the world. China exports 26% of their agri products comparing to india's 1.6%. people know maya means illusion.. so dont lecture and dont talk like a saint.