RE:Take the best of two worlds
by Vas on Mar 26, 2007 04:32 PM
It look like you always imbibed the twisted sense of logic while you were living in the US. Just because the youth everywhere are trying to imitate American culture doesn't imply that all aspects of that culture are superior and thus appealing to all. The various aspects of the culture (discos, nightclubs, boozing, rampant sex, drugs, etc) that you mentioned attract the youth because they appeal to the lower instincts of man. These very aspects of the culture are something that many Americans themselves despair of, and would like to rid the society of.
You seem to equate all developed countries with American culture. In many developed western countries, you also do NOT address your superiors by their first names. So there is nothing 'developing vs developed country' about cultural protocols in social exchange. Each culture has its own ways of social exchanges, and there is nothing innately inferior or superior about the protocols. Even in the US, the president is NOT addressed as George Bush by members of the public, but as Mr. President. Similarly, a senator is Senator X or Y (and not first name). In universities, students mostly address the professors as Dr. So-n-so, unless specifically requested by the professor to be called by first name. Seems like you are ignorant about protocols in the US in areas other than corporations!
I know good job, salary, technology and all the latest gadgets are important in life and for country. But we also need clean air, water, lakes, rivers, big urban parks, unspoiled jungles,high octane number fuel for automobiles, civilized society, good garbage and sanity disposal system, clean public transport, good social security, public services and public health care. We need place for walking, running, hiking, swimming pools, river rafting, cycling, skiing, boating and all sorts of sports activities for public.
USA MAY BE A LOUSY PLACE FOR THOS WHO ARE FULL TO THEIR STOMACH. But, it is still the country that is providing opportunity for the young and poor Indians, for making their livelyhood. Please DONOT BLAME USA JUST BECAUSE YOUR STOMACHS ARE FULL. Thousands of Indians are coming to USA every year and living freely and making a good life for themselves nad their relatives and friends back in INDIA. This is helping in reducing poverty of the common INDIANs. STOP YOUR ATTITUDE OF DITCHING AFTER TAKING HELP. I agree US may have some negatives, but as far as INDIANS are considered, we need money to uplift the 300 million or so of our population from dire poverty and US is helping directly to alleviate this problem, by allowing 75 thousand people from INDIA to come to USA via Student Visa, another 5 or 10 thousand via H1 visa and other visa's as well. Infact, USA is the top source of IT boom for India, where in, Majority of Indian youth are employed by IT industry. So, you see the opportunity we INDIANS are getting from USA to uplift our standard of living. PLEASE STOP SHOWING YOUR DITCHING ATTITUDE.
------------------------------------------------- THE ONLY SAD THING IS THAT, THE SO CALLED IMMIGRANT RICHEST ARE IGNORING THEIR MOTHER COUNTRY AND NOT DOING ANYTHING (or to max possibility) TO HELP UPLIFT INDIANS.
RE:USA is still land of opportunity for poor and needy people
by hello on Mar 26, 2007 05:56 AM
Who is telling US as bad. I am not, Indians not blaming US.
Some foreign guys here praising USA & by that chance, blaming India & US together like you said above!!!
Well America is a lousy place where only people who are not capable of having a future in India go to USA. Anyone who can earn 25 Lakhs per annum in India will never go and settle in America. USA is a place where one has to do everything by yrself and there are no luxuries as we have in India. Having lived in the USA for some time I realized its a fake life in US. Back In India if I earn more than 30 Lacs per annum I don't have to go anywhere in the world. india is the best.
RE:America a lousy place where only losers go
by chintan gosalia on Mar 25, 2007 10:47 PM
Rajesh,
You are one of those who sees money as the only success and satisfaction in life. I am not saying that India is not a good place but so is US. There are lots of things you can acoomplish in you life by staying in this country.
I will give a few examples: 1. You said people have to do everything on their own and there is no luxury. I am happy about that. Here servants are not treated like slaves and they are not forced to work round the clock. They are not paid under 2000 rupees a day where they can not buy food or clothes for their family. If I were you, I will not call it a luxury, but a form of slavery; the only difference being you pay them some money over the time period instead of paying one time some big money.
2. You do not have to humiliate yourself in US by paying a cop 50 rupees when you violate a law. There is self-respect and honesty (not in entirety by atleast more than in india). There is not a son of politician who run over people sleeping on road, kill them and get away in the court without a trial. You do not pay 20-30 lacs when your son is held on ransom or when mafias ask for this money without any reason. You can keep you head high in the air and live with respect and honor.
Said this; I am not saying India is not a good place to live. There are advantages of living in this country. I have lived in both countries and I think both places have something to offer. It all depends what is important for you in life.
So stop being a jerk who just treats all countries in this world as a hopeless place and India as the only place living worthwhile. I pity people like you
RE:America a lousy place where only losers go
by Vas on Mar 26, 2007 04:42 PM
My question - why is it necessary for you treat your servants as slaves in India? Why do you have to go to the US to learn to NOT treat them like slaves? My family has never treated their domestic help as slaves, but as employees - nothing more, nothing less, and my family didn't have to go to the US to learn that.
Your 'living life with head held high in the US' is gross exaggeration. I guess you have never lived in small towns in the heart of Klu-Klux-Klan regions. Try holding your head HIGH in those places, and see how long you (or your head) lasts. No wonder ever Indian, fresh off the boat, wants to live in california or new jersey, where he is somewhat protected by the cosmopolitan environment and is deluded into thinking that all of USA is like that!
RE:America a lousy place where only losers go
by sridhar gorantla on Mar 26, 2007 01:00 AM
USA MAY BE A LOUSY PLACE FOR THOS WHO ARE FULL TO THEIR STOMACH. But, it is still the country that is providing opportunity for the young and poor Indians, for making their livelyhood. Please DONOT BLAME USA JUST BECAUSE YOUR STOMACHS ARE FULL. Thousands of Indians are coming to USA every year and living freely and making a good life for themselves nad their relatives and friends back in INDIA. This is helping in reducing poverty of the common INDIANs. STOP YOUR ATTITUDE OF DITCHING AFTER TAKING HELP. I agree US may have some negatives, but as far as INDIANS are considered, we need money to uplift the 300 million or so of our population from dire poverty and US is helping directly to alleviate this problem, by allowing 75 thousand people from INDIA to come to USA via Student Visa, another 5 or 10 thousand via H1 visa and other visa's as well. Infact, USA is the top source of IT boom for India, where in, Majority of Indian youth are employed by IT industry. So, you see the opportunity we INDIANS are getting from USA to uplift our standard of living. PLEASE STOP SHOWING YOUR DITCHING ATTITUDE.
------------------------------------------------- THE ONLY SAD THING IS THAT, THE SO CALLED
RE:America a lousy place where only losers go
by manoj on Mar 26, 2007 01:56 AM
I also felt the same after staying in US for few months.
But later I stayed for few years in USA the attitude of myself changed and now I love USA and i have converted to christianity and become a US citizen to enjoy the free speech / low cost exercise centers/ fast internet/ clean air/ no illiterate neighbours/ things like this.
RE:America a lousy place where only losers go
by sridhar gorantla on Mar 26, 2007 06:02 AM
Dear Manoj, after converting christianity, did you find GOD? Or did you just convert to enjoy the benefits of the western world successes? If converted to find GOD, then, you will never be able to find it, cause the religion you were following was also same as christianity in the basic form. But, if you converted for material benefits, then, that is great. carry on.
RE:[object]
by Vas on Mar 26, 2007 04:46 PM
Oh brother - another semi-literate immigrant who thinks he has to convert to fit into American society. The very fact that you felt the need to convert to be able to get US citizenship and enjoy other 'perks' suggests that you don't consider US to be the 'equal opportunity' land, and that you felt that without converting you will not be able to make it in the society. Another Bobby Jindal in the making. Pathetic!
RE:America a lousy place where only losers go
by vijayendra rao on Mar 25, 2007 10:36 PM
You might want to reconsider using the choice of your words. A lot of big names like Desh Deshpande, Bose, CA have made it big in US. You think they are losers? These guys are good. And if you really have spent sometimne in US, I am sure you'll know about them!
RE:America a lousy place where only losers go
by srinivas nunna on Mar 25, 2007 01:22 PM
hi
i also feel in the same way , after my engineering grad i thought i will go and persume MS and settle there , after seing my brother already settled there , i setup a company here and i earn more than my Brother in US , so iam happy with my friends and enjoying the indian people .. what ever you earn its not your country .. srinivas@softscripts.net
RE:America a lousy place where only losers go
by Rajesh Yadav on Mar 25, 2007 12:32 PM
Add to that if I have a big villa and a luxury car in India , and add to it a typical 30lacs per annum package in the IT industry who wants to settle abroad - where there is always racisim, etc etc. ONly losers go to USA
To me top immigrants are those who did not compromise on their ethics to live here, or worked illegally despite having one spouse earning well enough as an IT engineer under the pretext of H4 visas are unfair. For me those are people whom I'd count as top immigrants who made their land of origin proud by not climbing the ladder of success by back stabbing anyone, or those diamond merchants' sons and daughters who've thousands of dollars for luxury yet work illegally in Indian stores here just for a so called "better life" and take away a job which, probably could have got a needy American or Mexican $5-6 an hour. And of course, go to any extent to get a green card. If your motherland is so bad, what will you all do if some day, for all you know, every originally American is asked to leave U.S.? Would you beg to be allowed to live here, where at least 1 out of 5 natural citizens hates you for taking away their jobs, where you know very well, no matter how much you earn, your kids will not ask you for a sip of water when you're dying, but yes, may try to schedule a great funeral "party" for you. A land where you live for earning, saving, showing off the wealth, showing off your kids are so great because deep within we're all Indians and want to patch-up our own mistakes, tell everyone my daughter does bharatnatyam, or "Oh my son understand every single word of Gujju but he's shy to speak and I'm okay, language is not important you see". Every person trying to patch up his own mistake and everyone participating in that race. Weekdays are spent at office with kids at baby sitter, and weekends socializing or kids activities where you're only tryying to do what others do- not what you should really do!
Yes, America is a land of opportunities and I am here too for the same reason but I know, the day my kids are born, I do not want to raise them in a Capitalist country where a religious festival such as Christmas is only about gifts, where in a class of 30 people, at least 20 have divorced parents or are themselves divorced yet, the culture here is to go crazy over "He proposed me"- for what? Leave you very soon for a 20 yr old with better figure? OR you ditch him for your wealthy boss?
Land of opportunities is truly that where you not only get bread and butter but also an enviroment conducive to show you the path of right and wrong. A country where everyone can freely carry a gun, 12-13 yr old girls are allowed to date, elders employed by kids to clean bathrooms, people obssesed with plastic surgeries- is that what we grew up to do? I know anti- Indian will bring up child-marriage but we're talking about the true India- true India is not child marriage, or dowry- we still worship women okay? Also I do not say every old parent must live with kids but, if my parents didn't throw me out when I demanded speical meals, crunched out time from thousands of chores and saved every penny to fulfill my wishes, then I better not say my husband, or my husband better not say that I do not get along with his family- that is crap!
No, I disagree, a land where only wealth and outer beauty is calculated as success, cannot be my "forever" land of opportunities.
RE:top immigrants
by Green Guy on Mar 25, 2007 08:44 AM
wow. some advice for the writer: grammar is ur friend, please use it wherever required. keep it concise n to the point.
RE:top immigrants
by Sal Suri on Mar 25, 2007 08:09 AM
I have to say that you are a pretty disturbed individual. You have this false impression that everything American is bad and everything Indian is good. Just like everything in life, both have their positives and negatives. Today's India is not much different from America as far as the negatives are concerned. Of course, if family life is important to you then you should be with them in India. One thing I will say with confidence, that despite your dislike for America, you will not leave it even when you have kids. Name one other country where you can thrive as a foreigner. Give America some credit.
RE:top immigrants
by Dipali Mahavir on Mar 25, 2007 08:20 AM
I absolutely would not take away that credit from America but then, Mother Teresa too made it big in India right? And who can forget East India company in India who eventually took over the entire nation- so who welcomed foreigners more is a different topic. I know the situations in India are not too good either but I don't think we're very okay to know our dad and mom are quitting their relationships and we see our new mom-dad when we're ourselves married! That was, and will remain some thing very uncommon in India.
I absolutely embrace the fact that here there isn't any female foeticide, or illiteracy, but there the conditions are our very own created. We all want to never go back, say things are same there but it can be controlled, provided it's not entirely given up into the hands of unwanted politicians.
And just to answer your extremely personal remarks- I am not disturbed but probably I indirectly hurt you for which I truly ask forgiveness- my religion asks me to ask forgiveness from every soul and I absolutely do not want to hurt anyone here. Sincerely- sorry! And yes, there are always exceptions and many people, which was unthought of, do go back. For whatever reasons, they do go back.
RE:top immigrants
by Sal Suri on Mar 25, 2007 09:05 AM
You don't need to apologize to me and I honestly feel sorry for using some harsh language. I am also an Indian and do hold traditional Indian family values very close to my heart. I agree that divorce is a big black mark on American society. But you can find equally bad things ocurring in Indian society. You mentioned female foeticide. The people who engage in this call themselves devout Hindus, worship goddesses and then kill these innocent female fetuses. At a recent mass wedding in South India, TV cameras showed how a father beat his daughter because she was not willing to marry the man he had chosen for her. This was done in a temple in front of a pundit and hudreds of devotees. No one stepped forward to stop it.
Anyway, let's hope that both societies mend their problems. God Bless.
RE:top immigrants
by aditya mutupuru on Mar 26, 2007 01:14 AM
hey father beat the daughter coz he marriage was fixed few months earlier she knows it well before that she going to marry him, later on she told that she got scared. i dot say father is right but know the facts in total before quotting the half incident.
RE:RE:top immigrants
by chandrashekar aazad on Mar 25, 2007 10:44 AM
Well Mr. Suri, Its better to listen to the lady, iknow she is right but you won't believe. If you need more information about the immigrants then go to the link written below...
www.notcanada.com i would appreciate everybody if they would let their near and dear to know about this site before they go to these countries
RE:top immigrants
by andre joseph on Mar 25, 2007 09:13 AM
The length of your sentences makes me feel you are confused about what exactly you want in life. If your plan is to go back to India after your studies, so be it. I wonder why at all you chose such a bad country to study. India has some of the best colleges in the world. Doing something illegal is bad, but I wonder if everyone who made it big in America made it out of his or her spouse working in Indian stores. Incidentally, if every American is asked to leave America, there wouldn't be any whites here as well. Only the native Indians can call themselves true Americans. I lived in Bangalore for a long time and know quite a few Keralites who are born and brought up in Bangalore and cannot speak Malayalam. So what would you call them? Also, if you are a South Indian and live in Delhi, do you know what your colleauges would call you behind your back? "Madarasi". So where is this true brotherhood you are talking about? I am yet to see much of it in India. How many of us from different states can see eye to eye in an office in India? In no time, it's the Mallu gang, Northie gang and so on. Yes, here in America the moment you have an argument too many with your spouse, you are either separated or Divorced. American obsession with data has ensured they know of every divorce that happens in this country. Do we in India have any such data? Do you know it is almost impossible to get a divorce in India. Relax the rules like in America and you can see the result. I would also like to know what you would do with your children if both you and your husband worked in Bombay. Of course, modern society is not genial and this is a trend which is fast catching up in India as well. The less said about women being worshipped the better. India possibly has the worst record when it comes to bride burning and forcing women to commit suicide. Worse still is the fact, you can get away with it if you have money to spare. Believe me, I am not India bashing. I am just stating facts as they are. America has some terrible problems, so does India. I have lived in America for just over a year and as far as I can see it, there is good and bad in every part of the world. I miss India terribly and long to go back, and I certainly will, but I also love the open space, the fresh air, the parks, the birds and everything that is good about America. Hating everything American while you are here can only make you feel lonely and out of place. Whereever you live, try to make the best out of the situation and if you cannot do that, it's time you packed your bags and caught the next flight.
RE:top immigrants
by Amit Pradip Wadke on Mar 25, 2007 09:32 AM
i do understand your concerns about USA, but isnt it the same with India too. Its about paying under the table for everything. Its like paying for the air you breathe. Also, have you ever wondered India is the largest democratic country and I would like to know where you see democracy. You can basically pay anything out of a nurder, rape or anything you want to be. You are living out of a farmer who works his blood out for your food that your children are not in a MOOD of eating tonight. Have you ever considered that India is Still a developing country where the old farmers which make 80 percent of India's occupational workers are feeling like, when you have left them far behind in terms of growth and development as a whole. Nobody is perfect, nor is USA or India for that matter but atleast every country has its side effects, even M K Gandhi was a hypocrite when he himself contradicted his statements to help the British during the first world war going against Tilak and others and then change his mind in the next world war. Dont you think indians have affairs, they beat their wives, go to brothels and the wives dont even find out, girls who are raped but there is NO democracy as its about your iamge in society to not expose that as you know you are never going to get anything proved in court as long as you can keep the judges happy. Also, everyone is hooked onto Ekta Kapoor's episodes about who is doing whom. INDIANS, WE NEED TO LOOK AT THE BIG PICTURE, WE ARE KILLING ARE HISTORY and CULTURE. Parenting is the answer to our culture. We will never be proud of where we came from, You should be thinking about BhagatSingh on Friday but I think we were too busy being upset about Indians losing to Sri Lanka, the same country who we are helping trying to stand up on its own. Bhagatsingh died so we his kids would see a better future. He never would have done it if he thought we would turn up in a bunch of leeches. I think Aamir Khan is one of the most patriotic actors who atleast showcases the long lost history of our country. I dont blame the police either, do you want to take that job, a person who gets paid Rs 5000 with a stick against the politician supported gangsters who carry big guns and can kill anyone who does not pay them their hafta.
Something has to change, and it has to change now, as you know whats going to happen is India is going to have its braindrain and all thats going to be left is the same as to what is happening in Africa.
RE:top immigrants
by sachin pandey on Mar 25, 2007 10:02 AM
I truely agrees to your views. but have u ever thought that if we are so proud of indian culture n ethics then we should be fighting to make our india a better place to live by our presence there...not by coming on H4 or H1 visa to sacrifice many things and save something at the end of the day. America...a land of opportunity but at the cost of many things....thats what i felt after a year stay here.
RE:top immigrants
by dharmendar reddy on Mar 25, 2007 10:58 AM
I believe that Dipali has somewhat narrow thoughts/opinions about how an individual has to live or lead life. Well if you could go to one extremism of thinking is there any way one could justify the notions such as Americans or indians...? are we all not part fot his earth??? and if yes i would say if i am in america leaving India i am doing nothing wrong. And addressing all these so caaled...ethics...could any one define me wat truley and ethical things mean?? to the ebst of my knowledge there is nothing abosolute about some behavior or act being ethical. perhaps the only thing that one could say about ethics is that it is a result of consensus of a huge number of people over generation and what might be ethical in this era may not be ethical in some other era. And may be with respect to your eyes there are positives and negatives in any thing that you see. But i must remind one that there is nothing positive or negative on its own. What may be positive , i mean good, say for a professional killer, after all he is earning his lively hood ( and i say this because if nature has created a hierarchy in the food chain, looking at which we feel justified an animal killing another is ok),will definatley be bad from your point of you but not from that persons point of view. I am not going to comment upon what is good and what is bad as it is one personal opinion but i give a humble suggestion that having come to america, if not any thing there is atleast one thing that you may one to appreciate and that is...Indian way of leading the life is not the only way of leading life.
There no point in talking about the success of a capitalist nation's new immigrants.We are hapy with our socialist reforms and we believe socialism will solve our problems.We don't believe in individual entrprunership and free market capitalism.We believe Government should interfere in every part of our life and our decision making,whether it is SEZ or PSU.We don't want to give permission to individuals start and own companies, everything should be Government owned and they should have leader like Lalu Prasad Yadav,who turns the thins in to profitable,which we are happy about that.
Thats why America is known as "Land of Opportunites".Anyone who has exceptional talent, skills and will-power to do, this is the place to start. I personally appreciate America's marketing policies, shrewdness, quick and smooth adoption to any change. Good luck America. Wish to grow more and more.
RE:True
by Firelite on Mar 25, 2007 05:57 AM
One small correction, You do not need to have 'EXCEPTIONAL TALENT', If you have talent, and willing to do HONEST hard work, the oppurtunity is always here in America.
RE:True
by Mrinal Biswas on Mar 25, 2007 10:32 AM
If you have talent and willing to do honest hard work...you will get ample opportunities in India...I am staying in USA for last 5 years. If you want materialistic life..America is the best place to stay...Just see how the IIM graduates are declining lucrative offers to stay in India...
RE:True
by s v on Mar 26, 2007 12:06 AM
There are talented Indians coming to USA to do their MS/PhD/MBA in top 20 Universities. These people come here primarily for quality of work and less for dollars.There are limited opportunities for these high fliers in India except in some jack welch research or as Faculty in IIT/IIM/IISc. There are then Indians coming here cashing in on the IT boom and harldy come here for the work content.Its all materialism for them.There are opportunities for them back in India too as salary levels are going up there too.But I guess the quality of living still keeps them in USA. Those with the enterpreneural bug and the skills America would be a better place but If you have the ability to deal with the difficult Indian conditions its always better there. There are shades of grey where people fall inbetween also.Homesickness haunt every Indian out there in USA irrespective of their background.
RE:True
by jagga sreenivas on Mar 25, 2007 07:20 AM
I totally agree USA is best place to live and make good life than india ,I have studied here and working now ,i work with a lot of indians from who come for short term and i see one thing is quality definitely is lacking in them than people here ,have lot of attitdue and unaccomodating people ...
RE:True
by sachin pandey on Mar 25, 2007 10:11 AM
i think u r wrong in that part..that quality is lacking in the indians who used to come here for temp basis. I think they always tried to give there 100 percent in front of american bosses who jus wan to give order n leave the office at 4 pm.
