There has been a considerable emphasis on producing BTechs and MBAs in the Country. This is one reason these institutes have started loosing their sheen as far as direct contribution to bridging the technology gaps which our non-IT/pharma industries face today, is concerned. It is no secret that technology gaps are widening as the years are passing by, even though we have been quite successful in producing sales people who have forcing the usage of materials produced by obsolete technologies down our throat at much higher prices. The real progress will come only when the technologies developed in our IITs are used by our next-door industries. The complex management problems that our industries face today require the solutions from our IIMs which they can provide only when they shift their focus their attention to management research in Indian Context. Open more National Institutes of Technolgy and Management to produce BTechs and MBAs. Identify why our industries are reluctant to adopt technologies developed in our laboratories. Force IITs and IIMs to take up research projects which are likely to be absorbed by the industries.Ask the industries to finance such research projects.
Reduction of fees of IIMs and other business schools is a retrograde step. Having started my career as a teacher in a business school, I would know quite a lot of what goes on in the inside.
Firstly, for a change 'teaching' or 'professorship' has become a viable career option in terms of earning potential for a fresh graduate. An fresh graduate starts with a salary of around Rs.15000 per month while the starting salary for a Ph.D at an Associate Professor level of around Rs. 19000. Remember that it takes at least 5 years of hard work from graduation to Ph.D. If a fresh graduate worked for two years and then did an MBA for another two years, in five years time he would easily outstrip his professor. As a result you would rarely see one of the brightest brains turning to teaching as a viable career option.
Any move to reduce the fees of the non IIMs would lead to people no longer looking at teaching as a viable option.
Secondly so much is being written and emphasised about research that one needs to remind the IIMs and everybody else that 'teaching' is also important.
Thirdly Dr. Joshi would be better off spending Government money on primary education than on IIMS.
IITs are known for its students (mainly BTechs) - not for its profs. IIT-JEE is considered one of the toughest examinations. The education in IITs is just a training for the cream to enter the "professional" world. Being an IITian myself, I feel that the faculty cant justify the sub-standard education for the quality students. People who have read the interviews of successful IITians will realise the importance of their class-mates in the making.
If other Universities have more PhDs than IITs, then why didnt their Alumni succeed more than IITians in various parts of the world? The answer is simple. IIT sets higher standards for admission. Many prospective students with deserving skills prefer admissions abroad for the lack of future professional opportunities in India. Most of the BTechs themselves go abroad for better opportunities. The government should invest the taxpayers money in commissions that investigate into the proper cause of the problem.
But frankly speaking, the world market is moving towards India. Most of my classmates stayed back in India working for MNCs and startups. It is for the govt to keep this market growing and attract more such talented people.
Well, Why cut fee and increase the number of students. Isnt there any other solution . Well consider my opinion.... The problem the HRD feels is that there is not enough returns from IIT/ IIM ians in terms of serving the country and research outputs. Well Why will they?? I think the Mtech and Phd holders dont find their job as a researcher in India interesting or lucrative enough as in US , and also research is not backed up by the industry. So why dont they attend to the root cause instead of beating round the bush... Its high time that Mr. Joshi realises that quality is more important than quantity and it would be better if he has plans to retain and get more out that quality.
First of all i thank Murali Manohar Joshiji for raising such questions against IITs/IIMs. because this issue should have been in limelight long back. i think the country is getting almost zero returns from IIT graduates. Please dont go on comments from US/ Europe and all that IITs are great institutions/brand names etc. No doubt they are but why US is making such comments because its US and other western countries which are benefiting from IIT graduates and not India. You will find more than 80 % IIT graduates are residing in US and other countries and not in India. i would suggest the govt to follow the madical stream stratergies like every IIT graduate will have to serve the country for atleast 3-4 years. I hope then only the money given to IITs will be of worth. Otherwise the money spend on IITians is of no use for the country.
Perhaps the deans of IITs and IIMs should seriously consider introducing BTech (Astrology) and MBA with Astrology major. In case of such an event more grants may flow in from MMJ as opposed to existing one being slashed.
RE:IITs, IIMs & MM Joshi
by vishwesh on Feb 08, 2004 05:47 PM
plz... open your minds we are infact employing these gore naukars...look at the BPO shift...us is afraid of their jobs coming to india...morover with the opening of the economy we should understand that untill and unless we have really world class entrepeuners,managers and technocrats we won't survive and most of us iitians with the opening of market want to stay and are staying here.
iit professionals have not just earned respects for indian professionals abroad but also made our country's position strong when it comes to world trade affairs..
the only proffesionals of whom we can boast of is our technocrats.
Joshi is 100% correct, I have seen through out that these institutes have catered to Elites , i have not seen a single Student who has come from poor family back ground, after getting the education from IIT/IIM these guys go to USA to make more money instead of working in india citing all convenient theories, but the reality is these people have got all best education from TAXpayers money!!!!!
I have got one suggestion, make 2000 seats IIT per State , fix the fees as per the income, give some 20% reservation for Rural candidates
like wise its better to remove group discussion from IIM as it is catering to Elites who got educated in Convents
The ex head may be right in claiming that not a single student was refused admission in past who cleared the entrance test but was unable to meet the money requirement. However, two things have to be considered before accepting his logic for not reducing the fees. First, the mere indication of the fees in the brochure is a severe deterrent for prospective poor and meritorius candidates to take the test. Second, the cost of preparation is also very high for a poor candidate because of the high fees charged by the privately run institution that help the candidates for preparation. And anybody who has gone through the process knows how difficult it is to prepare without aid of this private institutions. It simply becomes an unfair competition. Having said that, I dont justify the 'reservation' for the poor student. My suggestion is that government should subsidise the fees and provide some sort of monetary assistance for 'poor and good' student for the preparation. The assistance in the form of scholarship can be provided based on the academic track record of the student and his financial situation. This policy should be clearly highlighted in the brochure.
It's an irony that M F Hussain's mere rendition raised such a furore a couple of years ago whereas the actual rape of the educational system is going on right under our noses and we choose to treat it as food for rhetoric! Here are some hard truths... -The name that IITs have made is primarily thanks to its undergrad output. But an undergrad education is extremely general to record substantial research output. The fact that these people do come back (yes they do, i did!) to pursue research in this country, doesn't change the fact that increasing intake at BTech level is NOT going to increase research output. -Comparing fee structures with the west is fallacious because the system of educational loans is far progressive there than in our country where it's still seen as from undeserved to axing-your-own-leg-stuff. -Please cut that student-teacher ratio vis-a-vis some B-school in Germany crap, Dr Joshi! Whoever heard of any B-school in Germany worth its name? -Anyhow, the social emancipation through education theory is basically related to primary education. A question for Dr Joshi: If your hear noises from the rear of your car, do you dismantle your perfectly working steering?
Some head of IIM points out that .... there is not even one instance of a student having cleared the entrance tests and not being admitted because he/she couldn't afford it. Probably true, but reason may be different. A good student from middle / poor class will not dare to appear for entrance test, because s/he knows s/he cant afford it. So why waste money to test himself and get frustrated.
IIT's/IIM's are doing definitely well but there is too much hype. They make the entrance test tough to get the best talent and then train them to boost from 95 to 98. Delta is too little. Where as many other institutions struggle hard to convert mediocre to good...a big jump...probably from 60 to reach 80.
Check one more statistics. How many IIT /IIM teachers's kids get chance in their own institution? If they are master in creating genius, they could easily make it happen to their own kids too.
I have nothing against these institutions except too much hype that is created by them and media, which is bad and it demoralizes and undermines remaining similar institutions.
