I DONT THINK THERE WAS ANYTHING WRONG WITH THE DECLARATION. IT WAS CORRECTLY ESTIMATED AND CARRIED OUT. IF THE RAIN GODS INTERFERED WITH THE PROCEEDINGS THEN IT IS NO FAULT OF THE CAPTAIN.
THE MEDIA AND THE SO CALLED EXPERTS ARE ALWAYS DISATISFIED WITH THE PROCEEDINGS AND JUDGMENTS OF THE MEN ON THE FIELD. IF DHONI HAD DECLARED EARLIER AND IF NEW ZELAND HAD GOT THE IMPOSSIBLE RUNS AS IS BEING THOUGHT ABOUT THEN THE SAYING WOULD BE THAT DHONI MISJUDGED THE TIMING. CRICKET IS A GAME OF GLORIOUS UNCERTAINTIES AND SCORES WHICH HAD NEVER HITHERTO BEEN ACHEIVED IN THE LAST INNINGS HAVE BEEN ACHEIVED ALBIET EVEN IN A LOSING CAUSE. SO KUDOS TO DHONI FOR BRINGING HOME THE SERIES WIN AND ACHEIVING THAT WHICH GREATER CAPTAINS IN THE PAST HAVE NOT ACHEIVED FOR 41 YEARS
Re: DECLARATION
by Chennai Tiger on Apr 09, 2009 12:51 AM
Don't get carried away Arun - I am a Dhoni fan no matter what. But here he blundered. A test win away is not easy to come by that too in NZ, he simply killed the golden duck where there were absolutely no risks with stupid reasons.
Though I agree, we need to preserve series win, there should hv been better plan to push 2-0 not over conservative as he did here.
very stupid of Dhoni if you look at the facts - we should hv gone for quick runs after lead of 450. We lost min 1hr there.
Also weather report which I could read clearly on 3rd day itself - there will be no rain on 4th day and rain after noon on 5th day. I can't believe being local & gets enough brains to determine accurately.
Even if weather changed a bit, he could hv easily planned around that.
Test cricket is not one day or T20 cricket - you can use your best bowlers and set field placings as you like and can delay a bit, bowl one sided, bowl wider ones if there is danger as you mentioned. And with big target, you have enough time to adjust. If Target was 500, if NZ kept attacking, set buffer at 250 and stop attacking & set defensive fields - its not that difficult to manage for a draw then, which was what achieved eventually anyway.
We missed GOLDEN opportunity for 2-0 and thus #2 with ICC rankings due to very bad decision.
I can't believe Dhoni scratching around for runs on 4th day after 7th wkt fell for ~30 mins before decl. That 30 mins would hv changed the result too - minor things but major difference.
Re: Re: DECLARATION
by ashish on Apr 09, 2009 04:47 AM
Good thoughts Tiger.. I like Dhoni too, but that was just strategy. While reading commentory on cricinfo, I even send a message that Indians need to rush and get to 600 and declare before day ends and bowl. Given that game stopped 30 minutes early on 3rd day, but they still should have rused or declared at the end of the day at 570 odd runs
Re: Re: DECLARATION
by Sumit Dubey on Apr 09, 2009 05:31 AM
So Dhoni should have known in advance that Ishant Sharma would drop a sitter 15 minutes before it will start pouring down, and that bad light would stop play much earlier than normal. Not to mention that the last two days started at the same time in the morning despite day light savings.
And he should have ignored that New zealand would have gone all out to achieve a 500 target which could have made the result 1-1.
Re: Re: Re: DECLARATION
by VancouverPunekar on Apr 09, 2009 08:35 AM
in the history of test cricket no team has chased more than 450 and a total in excess of 400 has been chased only 3 times.
We are talking about 1800 tests !!!
Also consider this we are potentially a top team and kiwis are at the bottom.
if the weakest team can chase somethign which no one in the last century has. then the weak team (kiwis) really deserve to win and we dont deserve to aspire to be no 1
Re: Re: Re: DECLARATION
by Janardhana on Apr 09, 2009 08:53 AM
Dropped catches do happen, you can't taken that into account, but clearly weather forecast was there in the 3rd day itself. Moreover, even if not for weather forecast, when you are so dominating and dictating, you should go for kill and not wait thinking that oh, there are 2 more days and plenty of time, so we will bat for our records. this is the poor attitude. If 500 was not safe then what was the basis that 600 was safe.
Re: DECLARATION
by Kaustav Kakati on Apr 09, 2009 12:19 AM
why would anyone think that the opposition (that too NZ) could score even 450 runs in a 4th innings? this defeatist mentality will not take us anywhere. do u for a moment think the Aussies wud batted a run more than 500?
Re: DECLARATION
by Ravi B on Apr 09, 2009 04:29 AM
Arunji....
Cricket is uncertain but weather forecast isn't especially in NZ.
The Wellington test match was all for India to win. My view is that India could have gone for an all out attack on the 3rd day evening to be closer to their target setting of 600-odd & put NZ to bat on 4th day morning itself.
Re: Re: DECLARATION
by ABHISHEK REWANDKAR on Apr 09, 2009 09:34 AM
Hey u all fools... why dont u think in other ways... in cricketthere are no ifs and buts.... so what if the rain would have started on 4th day itself and spoiled the whole 4th and 5th day.. Can u predict the weather god in NZ... u cant... so just shut up and stop blaming others like fools.. Dhoni or any other captain would have done what they think is right, abd thats why they are captains... and not the ppl like u fools... haa haa haa
Re: Re: DECLARATION
by Subhash Bose on Apr 09, 2009 10:33 AM
This is my reply to all of the interesting comments from the people. The ideas are well expressed and I see sense in both views- declaring early vs declaring late. I can only say that we are all discussing this coolly only becos India won the series. Imagine, how bad it would if NZ pulled through an amazing victory (a miraculous win, but we have seen records being made/ broken many a time when no one ever expected them to happen!!!). None of the above pundits would have been remotely supportive of Dhoni if that decision had cost us the series. I think that Dhoni should commended for his gr8 job (a historic win indeed, no matter what one may say) and I am sure that he will learn a lot from this experience. Enjoy folks- JAI HO / JAI HIND
captaincy makes a lot of difference. the same ind team which played 2 tests against ausis at home, were draw under kumble's capt. but 2 victories under dhoni's capt. in 2 tests in nz under dhoni's capt, 1 win n another win missed due to weather. but 1 test under veeru's capt, draw which was saved under lots of pressure.
so captaincy changes the fortunes of the team. a good capt is successful in geting the best out of his team. even if the best team given to a bad capt, he cant win the matches.
Though I agree, we need to preserve series win, there should hv been better plan to push 2-0 not over conservative as he did here.
very stupid of Dhoni if you look at the facts - we should hv gone for quick runs after lead of 450. We lost min 1hr there.
Also weather report which I could read clearly on 3rd day itself - there will be no rain on 4th day and rain after noon on 5th day. I can't believe being local & gets enough brains to determine accurtately.
Even if weather changed a bit, he could hv easily planned around that.
Test cricket is not one day or T20 cricket - you can use your best bowlers and set field placings as you like and can delay a bit, bowl one sided, bowl wider ones if there is danger as you mentioned. And with big target, you have enough time to adjust. If Target was 500, if NZ kept attacking, set buffer at 250 and stop attacking & set defensive fields - its not that difficult.
We missed GOLDEN opportunity for 2-0 and thus #2 with ICC rankings due to very bad decision.
I can't believe Dhoni scratching around for runs on 4th day after 7th wkt fell for ~30 mins before decl. That 30 mins would hv changed the result too - minor things but major difference.
Re: BCCI should award ICL for NZ series win
by vinay on Apr 08, 2009 11:03 PM
true. just one shane bond had made a lot of difference to nz team from club level to intnl level. the only one with the help of whom, nz cud fight witht he mighty ausis n who became the reason for removal of captaincy of steve waugh. just like the nz team which was bolstered by the likes of richard hadlee n martin crowe during their days.
Re: Re: BCCI should award ICL for NZ series win
by Cricketlover on Apr 09, 2009 01:49 AM
I dont fully agree with this... The flat pitch also caused a lot of help to the Indian cause. If we would have got a green pitch then we could have struggled. A glimpse of it was seen in Christchurch oneday. When our batsmen could not counter the swinging delieveries and got out cheaply.
Re: Re: Re: BCCI should award ICL for NZ series win
by ashish on Apr 09, 2009 04:50 AM
I don't fully agree with you either... with the green pitch NZ batters would have struggled more then Indians. Indians were much accomplished batters then NZ and they showed in entire series aginst the new ball
Re: Martin just loves his job at Bangalore Royal Challengers.
by prem chopra on Apr 08, 2009 10:55 PM
hi fool dont u know that he had already left the job of royal challenger.
Re: yes
by sanath on Apr 08, 2009 09:08 PM
If pawar and modi were responsible, India would have won the 2007 world cup and not gone out so disgracefully in the first round.
U really seem to be some jealous non-indian who tries to keep on posting the same statement expecting some support from fellow jealous non-indians. At the most u can only be pitied !
Re: yes
by Chennai Tiger on Apr 08, 2009 10:51 PM
man - India success in NZ is due to ICL and not IPL. Give credit to Kapil & co - BCCI should thank & give awards to ICL for keeping key players in their contract, thus not avail to their home country. Shane Bond & Tuffny were the architects of last series and were cooling their heels due to ICL.
Now they are telling India Might declared early, then India might bowled our NZ.
But if the situation changed and the Ryder and Taylor might played some T20 cricket????
THen these guys will speak that, India might played some more time. These guys will always think some imposs things.
THen will ask them to think Dhoni decision against Aus in India(Fielding).
He s always thinking in negative way.
No body done any great thing in NZ for the past 41 years. But now Dhoni did that.
We should encourage them, we should not balme them for one test match loose.
If you think as a cricketer, we won that 3rd test also, when you know that you can win a match, that time itself you won that that, so India won that test and series as 2-0.
Re: They will tell anything...
by ragesh gr on Apr 08, 2009 08:03 PM
Mr crow you can give advises and suggestions to ur players.you tell NZ players way to improve. we have got lot of legends way aheadof you in india. UNDERSTAND .WHO R U TO APPLAUD INDIA. EVERYBODY KNOWS INDIA PLAYING GREAT CRICKET. DONT WANT TO HEAR FROM U FOOOOL
Re: Re: They will tell anything...
by Chennai Tiger on Apr 08, 2009 10:57 PM
He was one of the best commentators - very unbaised if you watched the live coverage.
Re: Re: They will tell anything...
by kalyanaraman s. on Apr 08, 2009 08:57 PM
this is real meanness, isn't it ? when someone admires the team for its performance, have the basic decency to acknowledge that and be humble/gracious about that. Maybe, it is too much to expect from a screwball like you ?!
By the way, Martin Crowe is not as foolish as you think. he was the one who mucked us up during the 1992 world cup, using our own weapon called spin !! Again, maybe you memory is short !!
Re: They will tell anything...
by sanatomba kshetrimayum on Apr 08, 2009 09:04 PM
My dear, in the history of test cricket, how many times a country scored more than 450 runs while chasing the 2nd inningstarget. Moreover, the weather in Willington was assisting bowlers.....Truly Dhoni was so timid...for the late declaration...
Re: They will tell anything...
by Chennai Tiger on Apr 08, 2009 11:09 PM
very stupid of Dhoni if you look at the facts - we should hv gone for quick runs after lead of 450. We lost min 1hr there.
Also weather report which I could read clearly on 3rd day itself - there will be no rain on 4th day and rain after noon on 5th day. I can't believe being local & gets enough brains to determine accurtately.
Even if weather changed a bit, he could hv easily planned around that.
Test cricket is not one day or T20 cricket - you can use your best bowlers and set field placings as you like and can delay a bit, bowl one sided, bowl wider ones if there is danger as you mentioned. And with big target, you have enough time to adjust. If Target was 500, if NZ kept attacking, set buffer at 250 and stop attacking & set defensive fields - its not that difficult.
We missed GOLDEN opportunity for 2-0 and thus #2 with ICC rankings due to very bad decision.
I can't believe Dhoni scratching around for runs on 4th day after 7th wkt fell for ~30 mins before decl. That 30 mins would hv changed the result too - minor things but major difference.
Re: They will tell anything...
by sg on Apr 08, 2009 10:18 PM
@RajendraK,
I fully agree with you. And not to mention McCullum and Vettori's batting abilities. And there were a few catches dropped, so if 'ifs and buts' can be taken into considerations like, 'if only Dhoni had declared sooner', then there would be a bunch of them.
Choice of words. That's the message Martin Crowe's blog has for so many of us who are linguistically and mentally challenged. Beautiful use of the language. Amazing how NewZealanders, be it Sir Richard Hadlee, Ian Smith or Martin Crowe, always seem to make the best use of the English language as opposed to the perenially snobbish English and their equally self-consumed Australian counterparts.
Re: TIME LOST
by Chennai Tiger on Apr 09, 2009 12:59 AM
And do you know who was the culprit - Indian team mgmt (incl captain) denied starting one hr early on those days before the match. NZ agreed to play.
Mindset was less # of overs, more chances to salvage a draw if things go wrong - but it severely backfired since we started dominating and needed the additional time.
So its not nature or NZ team, but our team mgmt making another bad choice.
Re: Online Legitimate Part Time Job Involves typing online forms.
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Re: Online Legitimate Part Time Job Involves typing online forms.
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